So, I've scrapped the entirety of my magic system, including the compendium list of spells that I'd accumulated, and replaced it with a free-form system somewhat reminiscent of the casting system in Fabletop or the skill and magic system in Shadowrun. For purposes of nostalgia (and because I'm not ready to scrap my list of weaponry and make all weapons of any given size equal), I still have physical combat within the d20 set-up.
So how does this make things simpler?
I have some basic rules for how spells work, and how adding on different effects increases the cost of any given spell on casting. But by making the magic system entirely free-form I eliminate the need for resource books. No more looking up spell descriptions.
It makes it potentially more powerful, sure. High-powered mages have always been powerful. And there's still the limiter of "I'm the DM," plus the added bonus that a player can't point to the rulebook and say "but, but, but!" Plus, it gives the player an excuse to roll a whole bunch of six-siders, which is always fun.
My test subje-erm... game tester has brought up the concern that it can be easier on the player to have a list of spells to work from, the idea that you can look in your toolbox and see what you've got. And while there is some truth there, if a player wanted to they could write down spells they've used or come up with to refer from later on as well. I think the potential for versatility and accessibility outweighs that particular bonus. Plus, I've already come up with a short list of example spells that simulate well-known effects, so if someone says "well what can I do?" I can hand them that list.
Another aspect of this free-form system is that it means any caster can cast any spell. Healing, direct-damage, buffs/debuffs, whatever, is free game. Because as I've discussed here before, the idea that any given person can't figure out how to make a spell work in their own tradition is a bit weak. So I have two spellcasting traditions, Arcanist and Spiritualist. You can claim the power comes from a potato on a string around your neck, if you like - the only mechanical difference is which of the two spellcasting stats you use for your primary.
This free-form system will also work for psionics, and I have the mechanics in place to support a psionic system, but psionics have always been a bit game-breaking as far as power goes, primarily due to the general non-existence of psionic-resistant monsters. I'm thinking I may keep psionic ability as a rarity, rolled at character generation, as my mother does it.
Showing posts with label Arcane vs Divine. Show all posts
Showing posts with label Arcane vs Divine. Show all posts
Thursday, February 20, 2014
Free-Form Featherfall
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Monday, March 25, 2013
Staring back at myself
Sometimes I just have to stare something in the face long enough before I can see it.
Sorcery is Arcane. Ritualism is Divine. The four schools that were under each are combined into one skill.
Is this a perfect balance? Well, no. Transmutation as a spell group has always dominated the list by the sheer number of spells it has. As it is, I'll be going through the Arcana Unearthed spells and redistributing them as I feel appropriate. Because I can do that. And I'll probably add in a few here and there that I really liked the flavor of (probably a good deal from the Arcanis system). And I'll remove the typical summoning spells, replacing them with my preferred one-shot summons, and that by itself should help balance between the two groupings.
Spellcraft as a skill would allow access to more complex magics from the other magical discipline (skill in either discipline would give access to the simple spells from any school). Exotic spells from your own discipline could be learned at ranks 3, 6, and 9, and more could be learned (from either discipline) through the use of Combat Proficiencies.
Unrelated quick thought: Base exotic weapon proficiency on a new Weaponmaster skill - each rank gives access to the exotic weapons of a different basic group (polearms, heavy blades, etc.), chosen by the player upon placing points in the skill.
Sorcery is Arcane. Ritualism is Divine. The four schools that were under each are combined into one skill.
Is this a perfect balance? Well, no. Transmutation as a spell group has always dominated the list by the sheer number of spells it has. As it is, I'll be going through the Arcana Unearthed spells and redistributing them as I feel appropriate. Because I can do that. And I'll probably add in a few here and there that I really liked the flavor of (probably a good deal from the Arcanis system). And I'll remove the typical summoning spells, replacing them with my preferred one-shot summons, and that by itself should help balance between the two groupings.
Spellcraft as a skill would allow access to more complex magics from the other magical discipline (skill in either discipline would give access to the simple spells from any school). Exotic spells from your own discipline could be learned at ranks 3, 6, and 9, and more could be learned (from either discipline) through the use of Combat Proficiencies.
Unrelated quick thought: Base exotic weapon proficiency on a new Weaponmaster skill - each rank gives access to the exotic weapons of a different basic group (polearms, heavy blades, etc.), chosen by the player upon placing points in the skill.
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Friday, February 22, 2013
Sorcery vs. Ritualism
In the interests of simplicity, then, I'm once again taking a look at the magic system. Dividing things up into schools of magic, while it makes sense in some ways, has also imposed some limits that were not intended. Not to mention that the sheer volume of spells I've accumulated from so many different sourcebooks in order to fill out the lists of some of the lesser endowed schools (such as Divination) makes sifting through them prohibitive. Of course, the idea of rendering all that work invalid has only been more and more distasteful the more I've added to it, but I think something needs to give.
Part of this stems from reading through another sourcebook, Monte Cook's Arcana Unearthed. In this book, magic has been separated according to complexity. Every level has simple spells, which any caster might access, complex spells which might require greater training or access, and exotic spells, spells that might become the signature ability of a character because of their rarity or difficulty. And the book has its own magic spells, already separated into these categories.
Trying to just cram it into the full list would destroy the balance. Trying to split the full list into simple, complex, and exotic is an ambitious and prohibitive project. It would be easiest, if I want to use this method, to simply use only this one spell list, but it is tiny in comparison to what I have, and there are entire schools with less than ten spells total, and none in the first few levels. Transmutation, as per the usual, has the most spells, including a few I disagree should be placed there, but others have also commented on the favoritism Cook shows for Transmuters. Obviously, this wouldn't work for a system where schools of magic are learned individually.
And so I'm considering scrapping all of this subdivision, and offering simply two choices: Sorcery, and Ritualism.
Sorcery, based on Mind stats, akin to Dragaeran sorcery, where the caster simply pulls energy (either to him or from within, I'll leave that to the player's flavor preference) and tosses it to achieve the desired effect. This would apply also to any magic system where memorization is more important than intuition, though it could be argued that the use of magical formulae is ritualistic.
Ritualism, based on Soul stats, which might be Eastern witchcraft, or religion-based, or even bardic magic - any ritual-based magic.
I'm not sure if this will be the final iteration or not. There are some discrepancies, I'm sure. Discworld wizards, for example, might well be ritualists with such a system, especially when you consider some of the high-powered magic such as the Rite of AshkEnte. But, considering how the Disc works, and what that Rite in particular does, that may not be inappropriate, especially if you go back to Pratchett's Sourcery. More concerning might be that magic used by divine beings might be categorized as Sorcery, since they're simply lobbing energy. Another explanation might be that they're imposing their will upon the cosmos, which would place their magic as being based on Willpower stats.
But all of this is simply a matter of semantics, a matter of the magic's origin, and not a matter of what you can do with it. Arcana Unearthed uses the same spell list for all caster types, leaving it to the player (and a handful of various feats and methods of altering magical effects selected by the player) to determine the flavor. This method would mean that the source of magic has no bearing on its limits - a Sorcerer might heal someone just as well or better than a Ritualist. It does away entirely with the debate of cleric vs. mage, arcane vs. divine, and says instead, "This is what is possible. How you get there is the fun part."
In some ways, though, it seems they should complement each other. Let's use the Force as an example: most of the active abilities used in combat such as a Force Push or even the Jedi Mind Trick would be based in Sorcery, in the Mind. The ability to use the Force as a means to predict the future, or to commune with deceased Masters, or to sense a great "disturbance" would be based in Ritualism, in the Soul. So how do I account for this?
Maybe I should just forego Mind and Soul entirely, and create a Magic stat, then separate spells by casting time - anything longer than a standard action is based in Ritualism.
Part of this stems from reading through another sourcebook, Monte Cook's Arcana Unearthed. In this book, magic has been separated according to complexity. Every level has simple spells, which any caster might access, complex spells which might require greater training or access, and exotic spells, spells that might become the signature ability of a character because of their rarity or difficulty. And the book has its own magic spells, already separated into these categories.
Trying to just cram it into the full list would destroy the balance. Trying to split the full list into simple, complex, and exotic is an ambitious and prohibitive project. It would be easiest, if I want to use this method, to simply use only this one spell list, but it is tiny in comparison to what I have, and there are entire schools with less than ten spells total, and none in the first few levels. Transmutation, as per the usual, has the most spells, including a few I disagree should be placed there, but others have also commented on the favoritism Cook shows for Transmuters. Obviously, this wouldn't work for a system where schools of magic are learned individually.
And so I'm considering scrapping all of this subdivision, and offering simply two choices: Sorcery, and Ritualism.
Sorcery, based on Mind stats, akin to Dragaeran sorcery, where the caster simply pulls energy (either to him or from within, I'll leave that to the player's flavor preference) and tosses it to achieve the desired effect. This would apply also to any magic system where memorization is more important than intuition, though it could be argued that the use of magical formulae is ritualistic.
Ritualism, based on Soul stats, which might be Eastern witchcraft, or religion-based, or even bardic magic - any ritual-based magic.
I'm not sure if this will be the final iteration or not. There are some discrepancies, I'm sure. Discworld wizards, for example, might well be ritualists with such a system, especially when you consider some of the high-powered magic such as the Rite of AshkEnte. But, considering how the Disc works, and what that Rite in particular does, that may not be inappropriate, especially if you go back to Pratchett's Sourcery. More concerning might be that magic used by divine beings might be categorized as Sorcery, since they're simply lobbing energy. Another explanation might be that they're imposing their will upon the cosmos, which would place their magic as being based on Willpower stats.
But all of this is simply a matter of semantics, a matter of the magic's origin, and not a matter of what you can do with it. Arcana Unearthed uses the same spell list for all caster types, leaving it to the player (and a handful of various feats and methods of altering magical effects selected by the player) to determine the flavor. This method would mean that the source of magic has no bearing on its limits - a Sorcerer might heal someone just as well or better than a Ritualist. It does away entirely with the debate of cleric vs. mage, arcane vs. divine, and says instead, "This is what is possible. How you get there is the fun part."
In some ways, though, it seems they should complement each other. Let's use the Force as an example: most of the active abilities used in combat such as a Force Push or even the Jedi Mind Trick would be based in Sorcery, in the Mind. The ability to use the Force as a means to predict the future, or to commune with deceased Masters, or to sense a great "disturbance" would be based in Ritualism, in the Soul. So how do I account for this?
Maybe I should just forego Mind and Soul entirely, and create a Magic stat, then separate spells by casting time - anything longer than a standard action is based in Ritualism.
Wednesday, June 15, 2011
This is what happens when I have time to re-think...
So, I have the schools of magic separated into Arcane and Divine schools. Under the Divine heading, currently, I have Abjuration, Conjuration, Divination, and Necromancy. Arcane has Enchantment, Evocation, Illusion, and Transmutation.
Last night, I decided it made more sense to have Necromancy draw from Constitution for mana instead of Faith. I also began asking the question, again, of whether it should be an Arcane school instead. There are arguments both ways, since it was established pretty soundly that in order to be a "true" Necromancer, you'd have to take both Cleric and Wizard in 3rd Edition. Evil Clerics could Rebuke and Command undead, and got some undead creation and manipulation, including the Cause X Wounds spells, which heal their created and controlled minions. Wizards, despite being able to specialize in Necromancy and having access to various negative energy spells such as Vampiric Touch, didn't have much that would allow them to build and control an undead army. Since I've put everything together into the different schools, though, a Necromancer in my game would have (what I think) all the abilities a Necromancer should have access to.
But that still doesn't tell me whether it should be Arcane or Divine in origin.
If I were to make it Arcane, that would mean I had 3 Divine and 5 Arcane schools, instead of 4 of each. I don't know if that would truly be an issue, for balance or other reasons. I had moved Abjuration to Divine only somewhat recently, in order to make the number even, since it made sense that the school dealing with shielding and protection would be more Divine-based (although I guess that depends both on your view of the gods and the views of your god). I could move it back, since the two groups would be asymmetrical anyway, which would give Mage Armor back to Arcane casters, or I could move another Arcane group to Divine instead.
The Arcane schools that I could most easily see becoming Divine (aside from Necromancy) are Enchantment and Transmutation. Enchantment holds most of the iconic benediction spells, such as Bless, but then every school has spells that were originally divine, including Evocation (Flame Strike). Transmutation, though it does have some very iconic Arcane/Wizard spells, is primarily based around enhancement spells at low levels.
Or, I could scrap this whole Divine/Arcane debate entirely. Several campaign settings have already decided that ALL magic comes from the gods, in one way or another. I could simply state that there is no appreciable difference between them.
Any input on this would be appreciated.
Last night, I decided it made more sense to have Necromancy draw from Constitution for mana instead of Faith. I also began asking the question, again, of whether it should be an Arcane school instead. There are arguments both ways, since it was established pretty soundly that in order to be a "true" Necromancer, you'd have to take both Cleric and Wizard in 3rd Edition. Evil Clerics could Rebuke and Command undead, and got some undead creation and manipulation, including the Cause X Wounds spells, which heal their created and controlled minions. Wizards, despite being able to specialize in Necromancy and having access to various negative energy spells such as Vampiric Touch, didn't have much that would allow them to build and control an undead army. Since I've put everything together into the different schools, though, a Necromancer in my game would have (what I think) all the abilities a Necromancer should have access to.
But that still doesn't tell me whether it should be Arcane or Divine in origin.
If I were to make it Arcane, that would mean I had 3 Divine and 5 Arcane schools, instead of 4 of each. I don't know if that would truly be an issue, for balance or other reasons. I had moved Abjuration to Divine only somewhat recently, in order to make the number even, since it made sense that the school dealing with shielding and protection would be more Divine-based (although I guess that depends both on your view of the gods and the views of your god). I could move it back, since the two groups would be asymmetrical anyway, which would give Mage Armor back to Arcane casters, or I could move another Arcane group to Divine instead.
The Arcane schools that I could most easily see becoming Divine (aside from Necromancy) are Enchantment and Transmutation. Enchantment holds most of the iconic benediction spells, such as Bless, but then every school has spells that were originally divine, including Evocation (Flame Strike). Transmutation, though it does have some very iconic Arcane/Wizard spells, is primarily based around enhancement spells at low levels.
Or, I could scrap this whole Divine/Arcane debate entirely. Several campaign settings have already decided that ALL magic comes from the gods, in one way or another. I could simply state that there is no appreciable difference between them.
Any input on this would be appreciated.
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Saturday, April 9, 2011
Arcane, Divine, or something else?
Having split all of the available magic into the different schools, regardless of originating class, I realize now that I've blurred the Arcane/Divine division regarding the origin of magic. Some of the schools, like Conjuration and Necromancy, have a very definite Divine feel to them, though most of the benedictions Clerics got are now in Enchantment, and almost all their attack spells got dropped into Evocation.
Transmutation, as a school, has the most spells of any of them, with Evocation in second place, but the most expensive schools (in terms of experience cost for leveling) are Conjuration (because it has both summoning and healing) and Necromancy (because it can allow the caster to build an army of undead). These mostly reflect my preferences, I guess, which I picked up from my mother: I don't like messing with temporary pets/creatures, especially ones that can be changed with every casting. This is why I've replaced pretty much all the Conjurer's Summon Monster/Nature's Ally/whatever spells with one-shot, full-round summoning spells, FFTactics style. The entity bamfs in, does its thing, and bamfs out, end of discussion. Since it's summoning, not creation, this works and allows a Conjurer to summon things that do stuff outside the Conjuration school. Necromancy has a couple of modified spells tossed in to make it more like what it should be, in my opinion, but it's creation and not summoning which means I still have the temporary pet issue.
Back on track: the splitting of the schools means that some of my previous information, such as Arcane Spell Failure, is now either defunct or applies to a lot more than it used to. How do I deal with this?
Next up: Armor deterioration - Is it worth the hassle in a pen & paper venue?
Transmutation, as a school, has the most spells of any of them, with Evocation in second place, but the most expensive schools (in terms of experience cost for leveling) are Conjuration (because it has both summoning and healing) and Necromancy (because it can allow the caster to build an army of undead). These mostly reflect my preferences, I guess, which I picked up from my mother: I don't like messing with temporary pets/creatures, especially ones that can be changed with every casting. This is why I've replaced pretty much all the Conjurer's Summon Monster/Nature's Ally/whatever spells with one-shot, full-round summoning spells, FFTactics style. The entity bamfs in, does its thing, and bamfs out, end of discussion. Since it's summoning, not creation, this works and allows a Conjurer to summon things that do stuff outside the Conjuration school. Necromancy has a couple of modified spells tossed in to make it more like what it should be, in my opinion, but it's creation and not summoning which means I still have the temporary pet issue.
Back on track: the splitting of the schools means that some of my previous information, such as Arcane Spell Failure, is now either defunct or applies to a lot more than it used to. How do I deal with this?
Next up: Armor deterioration - Is it worth the hassle in a pen & paper venue?
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